What Happens Next -- A Drumpf Presidency w/ Republican Controlled Congress

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Re: What Happens Next -- A Drumpf Presidency w/ Republican Controlled Congress

Postby NaranjaRa » Fri Jan 20, 2017 10:02 am

this is an AMAZING article (and an overall one of my favorite websites for political analysis):
http://www.counterpunch.org/2017/01/20/ ... ica-great/

the whole thing should be read (pasted below) but i just want to highlight the main point...of...well, EVERYTHING:
...there can be no fundamental changes at the political level without taking on capitalism itself

yeah, see, i had to pull that out so everyone can really see that statement. and perhaps this will eventually start a discussion in a separate thread.

anywho, for now i highly recommend this oh-so-non-partisan look at what may lie ahead...

When Was America Great?

Donald Drumpf ran for President on the slogan “Make America Great Again,” implying that America had been great once, but no longer is.

True to form, Hillary Clinton’s rejoinder was clueless. America is great now, she would insist every chance she got — indispensably great, “exceptional” even.

Could there be a more empty-headed exchange of views!

After all, Drumpf was neither asserting nor implying anything; he was pitching a line to a demographic that he, advertising himself, wanted to target. Therefore, no rebuttal was called for; least of all, one as inane as Clinton’s.

But, of course, she was pitching a line too.

A cottage industry has lately sprung up analyzing the pathologies of Donald Drumpf’s personality. His public persona is inscrutable, however; it defies analysis for the simple reason that there is no there there.

Drumpf is a con man for whom reasons and evidence matter only insofar as they serve his purposes. He is whatever he needs to be at the moment.

Meanwhile, Clinton took her lead from the Ronald Reagan, “morning in America” playbook. The Gipper sold his snake oil by projecting a shallow, but infectious, optimism. However, for that to work, a sunny disposition is required. Hillary isn’t a good enough actor to pull it off.

All she could do was scare a lot of voters – a majority of them, it turned out — with the specter of the orange haired monster. As for promoting herself, she was hopeless.

Moreover, her take on the morning in America meme only fed the hostility of her detractors. How could it not? In their minds, she represented the “elites” behind the losses they felt.

They were right about that.

Meanwhile, Drumpf knew exactly how to play his marks by making them think that he could restore a past that they look back upon with nostalgia.

In reality, though, Drumpf cannot do anything of the sort, and wouldn’t if he could.

This is why, before long, “Make America Great Again” will stick in the craw of Drumpf voters in much the way that Obama’s “hope and change thingee,” as Sarah Palin called it, still plagues disillusioned Obamaphiles.

Obama was vague about what he wanted people to hope for, and what changes he saw coming. Drumpf is vague as well.

But it is obvious enough what he wants people to hear when he speaks of making America great — again.

Since Drumpf’s target audience was comprised mainly of people who are at least middle aged, it would be fair to say that his goal was to get them to think of post-War America as their personal Paradise lost.

This is nonsense, of course; but, by now, the span of time between the late forties and early sixties is remote enough to be looked back upon in ways that Drumpf could and did successfully exploit.

***

The man is anything but subtle.

He wanted his marks to yearn for a Golden Age in which hard working white men could make a decent living doing honest, productive labor in jobs that were not about to go away; and in which everybody else knew his or her place: blacks in the back of the bus, women standing by their men, gays in the closet, Hispanics in Mexico or Central America.

The pundits tell us that “Make America Great Again” is a dog whistle slogan – meaning that its meaning is audible to Drumpf’s target audience and no one else. Like so much else that liberal pundits tell us, this is nonsense. What Drumpf wanted people to hear was audible to everybody.

It is a noxious message, and a false one: even white men didn’t have it so good back in the day.

Nevertheless, as with much else that Drumpf says, there is something to it – just not what he intended.

For one thing, the political scene really was better in the Truman, Eisenhower and Kennedy years. Republicans were pernicious, of course, but no worse than Democrats are today. And the New Deal spirit still survived in sectors of the Democratic Party.

Democrats now, especially since Election Day, are many times worse than they used to be. Cold War Democrats had at least some measure of common sense and proportionality; Democrats today, for no plausible reason whatsoever, are hell-bent on taking the world to the brink of destruction, or beyond.

Hillary lost, but, within the ranks of the party she led, her Russophobic, neoconservative warmongering has taken on a life of its own. Can any sane person not be nostalgic for a time when Democrats were better than that?

It is all well and good to question the “legitimacy” of Drumpf’s presidency. There are so many questions that could be raised about that: voter suppression topping the list.

But Democrats cannot find it in themselves to do anything more edifying than blame those damn Ruskies.

This is not only preposterous; it is criminally reckless because all it does is prepare the public for war.

On this, “progressive” Democrats are as bad as the others; as bad even as Republicans like that perennial miscreant John McCain and his sidekick, Lindsey Graham.

Shame especially on “civil rights icon” and Clinton stooge John Lewis. The guardians of the status quo now find it useful to place him on a pedestal, just as they find it useful to de-radicalize and then venerate Martin Luther King.

In exchange for the honor, he does them yeoman service – as when he conflated still unanswered questions about Russian hackers with the legitimacy of Donald Drumpf’s election.

Civil rights icon indeed; the man belongs in a museum. Along with most of the rest of the Congressional Black Caucus, and nearly the entire membership of the incongruously named Progressive Caucus, he should just get out of the way.

Cold War Democrats were anything but “great,” but at least they didn’t make starting World War III their life’s work.

Drumpf obviously has no interest in transforming the Democratic Party for the better, and neither did voters who thought that a Drumpf presidency would make America great again.

Nevertheless, along with all the really bad stuff that Drumpf, and many of his fans, actually did have in mind, the nostalgia for the fifties and early sixties that he churned up does suggest a thought that is well worth taking on board — that neither Republicans nor Democrats need be quite as awful as they actually are.

Ironically too, Drumpf’s implicit appeal to post-War American values and norms helps sustain (small-r) republican ways of thinking about politics that are generally progressive and diametrically opposed to all things Trumpian.

From the sixteenth century on, there have been political thinkers in Western countries for whom ancient Sparta and the Roman republic served as political models. What they esteemed was their egalitarianism (applicable, however, only to free male citizens) and their ideal of civic virtue, according to which the public good takes precedence over individuals’ private interests.

In the ideal world envisioned by republicans, small, mainly rural, largely self-sufficient households prosper together – with no one rich, no one poor, and everyone happy.

America’s founders were influenced by republican thought – Thomas Jefferson, most famously – and, early on, strains of republican thinking found a welcome home in the collective consciousness of the American people.

The fortunes of republican thinking have waxed and waned in the years that ensued, as has the appeal of republican values – in part because republicanism’s fortunes and capitalism’s are thoroughly intertwined.

(Small-r) republican societies may not be full-fledged capitalist societies, according to one or another account of what capitalism involves, but they are relevantly like mature capitalist societies in supposing private ownership of major means of production and market relations. They therefore give rise to concentrations of wealth that undo the conditions for their possibility.

In this sense, their vision of ideal political-economic arrangements is utopian, unrealizable in real world conditions. Full-fledged capitalism, on the other hand, is astonishingly resilient; and, as everyone nowadays understands, it is capable of sustaining enormous levels of inequality.

In the years that people in Drumpf’s target audience look back upon yearningly, the inegalitarian tendencies inherent in the logic of capitalist development were effectively held in bounds by circumstances that cannot now be reproduced, and by the sustained efforts of a political class for whom memories of the Great Depression of the 1930s remained vivid. Those days are long gone.

Moreover, for nearly the entire post-War period, rampant, corporate and state sponsored consumerism has been militating against republican notions of civic virtue.

Even so, vestigial republican attitudes survive in the deepest recesses of the American psyche. In recent years, there has even been a revival of republican political philosophy in respectable academic precincts.

Therefore, one plausible understanding of “Make America Great Again” would be to see it as a call for America to recover its republican roots – by building a politics around the notions of freedom, equality, and virtue associated with the republican tradition.

Needless to say, this is not what Drumpf was promising. He stands for everything republicanism rejects.

Drumpf voters are obviously capable of believing almost anything, but it would strain even their credulity to see Drumpf’s “Make America Great Again” slogan as a call for equality, virtue, and the simplicity of manners and morals inherent in the republican ideal.

Perhaps this is why, to hear Drumpf and his defenders tell it, what has been lost that is worth restoring is not exactly the ways that American society accorded a semblance of homage to what republicans care about but something more pedestrian associated with it: the economic security that existed when manufacturing jobs abounded. That is what he claims he can restore.

But, of course, he cannot – not with what he is peddling. He can only do what mountebanks generally do: sell crap to the gullible and the desperate, counting on the power of suggestion to keep them on board long enough for him not to be run out of town.

This is all he can do for much the same reason that social democrats, these days, cannot hold back the neoliberal tide: because capitalism cannot be transformed or even tamed by government fiat alone.

Marxists were spot on right when they maintained that far-reaching changes of the kind that are desperately needed nowadays can only come about through class struggle. This is why, in the absence of a collective agent, able and determined to transform the underlying structure of capitalism itself, the broad contours of the status quo are regretfully secure.

Because neoliberal economic realities, and neoliberal state policies, have effectively reduced the labor movement to a shadow of its former self, leaving no functional equivalent in its place, this is indeed the situation we now find ourselves in.

Therefore, even if Drumpf wasn’t just blowing air – even if he really did want to restore manufacturing jobs — he would be unable to do anything of the kind.

Being both an opportunist and a showman, he will likely collude with a few of his fellow capitalists for a while — making them offers, at the taxpayer’s expense, that they cannot refuse. But without a counter-systemic social movement leading the way, he cannot defy the inherent logic of the system. No one can.

At this point in its development, that system has two major requirements, both of which militate against restoring anything like the conditions that, decades ago, created a large and secure middle class. It requires consumers able and willing to spend enough to keep aggregate demand at acceptable levels; and it requires a domestic work force that that is insecure and poorly paid, and therefore quiescent. These exigencies are at odds; precarious work situations and depressed wages depress consumption.

Neoliberals square the circle by transferring manufacturing jobs to low wage countries and then flooding the domestic market with goods that are so cheap that most Americans can still afford them.

Obviously, this “solution” doesn’t address any of the fundamental contradictions of neoliberal capitalism. If anything, it exacerbates them.

Drumpf owes his election, in part, to the discontents it generates. If those discontents continue, or intensify, he will have hell to pay.

Barring a radical change of course, the day of reckoning is sure to come; the only question is when.

If, in a vain effort to keep his supporters on board for as long as he can, Drumpf ratchets up more of the same – and what else could he do with the cabinet of dunces he has appointed, and without being a traitor to his class and to his own venality? – it could well come on his watch.

This will be wondrous to behold.

Had the Democratic Party not rigged the nomination process against Bernie Sanders, he would probably now be President, and he would find his efforts to restore the gains of the New Deal – Great Society era, and then to move beyond them, thwarted not just by the obstacles that (big-R) Republicans and rightwing Democrats (is there any other kind?) would put in his way, but by the same fatal contradiction.

The problem with Sanders’ “political revolution” was not just that it wasn’t radical enough or that it was too empire friendly; it was that, after the neoliberal assault on what little (small-d) democracy we had, there can be no fundamental changes at the political level without taking on capitalism itself.

But since Sanders was denied the nomination, that is a problem for another day. Drumpf is the problem now.

Surely, at some level, many, maybe most, Drumpf voters have known all along that there is nothing he could do that would restore the economic security they crave. They voted for him anyway, however. That is how desperate they were.

And so, he won; and, as surely as the sun will rise tomorrow, the shit will hit the fan.

Notwithstanding the willful blindness that is so rampant in liberal quarters, the problem now, had Hillary not flubbed so badly, would be to keep her and her fellow Russophobic neocons and “humanitarian” imperialists from vaporizing the world.

But because he is such a loose cannon, and in so far over his head, what lies ahead with Drumpf seems even scarier than that – even on matters of war and peace. If he does derail the War Party, then more power to him. But he is no more to be trusted to use the American juggernaut, nukes and all, wisely than any normally immature adolescent boy chosen at random.

Expect turbulence ahead! The time when it is still possible to postpone the inevitable choice between socialism – not the social democratic – Sanders version, but the real deal — or barbarism is fading fast. Thank Drumpf for that.
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Re: What Happens Next -- A Drumpf Presidency w/ Republican Controlled Congress

Postby NaranjaRa » Wed Feb 08, 2017 12:09 pm

Spoiler: show
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Re: What Happens Next -- A Drumpf Presidency w/ Republican Controlled Congress

Postby NaranjaRa » Thu Feb 09, 2017 9:31 pm

even this site can't keep up with it all

https://whatthefuckjusthappenedtoday.com/
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Re: What Happens Next -- A Drumpf Presidency w/ Republican Controlled Congress

Postby NaranjaRa » Tue Feb 14, 2017 5:41 am

FLYNN RESIGNED.
BOOM!

just you go ahead and keep dismissing Russia you naysayers...just keeeeeep onnnnnn....

what we're witnessing is not unlike what went down around the Toronto Mayor Rob Ford and his crack-smoking debacle. first it was rumors and heresay, then slowly, truth began to trickle on out...and soon the world was watching Ford light 'er up on national TV. not saying i want to see the alleged Drumpf golden-shower tapes, but you know what i mean...

//popcorn
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Re: What Happens Next -- A Drumpf Presidency w/ Republican Controlled Congress

Postby NaranjaRa » Tue Feb 14, 2017 6:13 am

also will someone please help me understand why there is no outrage that Drumpf is using his own private email server? after alllllllllll that cray about Hillary....hypocrites much?
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Re: What Happens Next -- A Drumpf Presidency w/ Republican Controlled Congress

Postby Skywalker » Tue Feb 14, 2017 7:04 pm

I am watching the White House Press thing.

Spicy is looking sick.

This administration has turned into a shit show...

Why I have stated that I plan to stay off topics like this. I just can't.


The Spicer is ending the show due to a Bill Signing....

I'll be back.. cause damn. Flynn becoming a scapegoat, the email server ... that shit that went down in FL. The rolling back of the clean stream stuff for Coal Mines.
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Re: What Happens Next -- A Drumpf Presidency w/ Republican Controlled Congress

Postby NaranjaRa » Wed Feb 15, 2017 12:51 am

i knew you couldn't stay away too long :giggle:

good news is they might be holding back on repealing the ACA because of everything else going on, low approval ratings, people storming their local offices, etc...might make people flip out even more if they tried that right now.
not to mention,
THEY HAVE NO OTHER PLAN (aside from privatizing again....le sigh)
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Re: What Happens Next -- A Drumpf Presidency w/ Republican Controlled Congress

Postby Feydakin » Fri Feb 24, 2017 8:31 pm

This will surely gets some hackles up... I never pretend to be anything but a Conservative leaning Libertarian. ;)
----------------------------------------------------------------
[11:05:42 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: Is there anything more fun that trolling Liberal snowflakes? I think not! :D
[11:06:15 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: I'm in the CPAC livestream just making people lose their minds and it's amazing lol
[11:17:57 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): the snowflake shit needs to stop...good lord the "buzzwords".... (dull)
[11:18:12 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): but have fun lol
[11:18:34 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): libs seriously need to figure out what's important though
[11:19:07 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): and we need the old school conservatives to take the GOP back from the tea party
[11:19:32 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): remember the portrayal of conservatism in the Newsroom?
[11:19:36 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: flashes hand signs
Image
[11:19:37 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): we need more of that
[11:20:26 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): oh yeah fuck little Goebbels
[11:20:44 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): not sure if I believe he's consciously doing that
[11:20:48 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: The country is making an adjustment after many years of Liberalism.
[11:20:59 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): as much as all the pics of politcians making the hail satan sign
[11:21:06 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: lol it's nothing, it' smade up BS fake news.
[11:21:13 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): oh there's always a lashback
[11:21:37 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): we go progressive for a bit and then the conservatives undo it all
[11:21:40 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): tug of war
[11:21:42 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): stupid
[11:22:11 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): how u feeling about Drumpf recently Feyd?
[11:25:06 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): I need to speak to someone who voted for him who isn't completely out of their mind
(chuckle)
[11:27:20 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: I wish he'd stop being so self congratulatory, but that's his nature.
[11:27:34 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): i met this girl around the time of the big bad ban, and she was super racist and all about Drumpf. so i started trying to find out where her opinions were. and at one point i told her how people were being asked (as they came into the country) how they felt about Drumpf, if they supported him, etc. and it just boggled my mind that she totally thought that was fine. "because he's our leader" was her answer. creeped me the fuck out.
[11:28:01 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): dude has that power to make anything about him
[11:28:12 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): but i guess some folks find that refreshing
[11:28:50 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: He's done some good and some not so good, but I wish Dems would stop with the obstructionism and at least let his cabinet get approved, and start trying to come up with compromises instead.
[11:29:41 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: If they couldn't stop Betsy DeVos they aren't going to stop any unless something really, really bad comes out about them...
[11:30:16 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: Then it can always come about as it did with Flynn, fired/resigned in shame.
[11:31:39 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: Honestly the more independent research I do, and really drill down to brass tacks on some issues with no political bullshit, I find less and less I dislike. It's really hard to find information that hasn't been tainted by political views though.
[11:32:01 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): the only person so far that i was actually somewhat ok with was Acosta to replace that POS who owns hardees
the rest are going to destroy their departments from what it sounds like.
i just don't like the idea of everything privitized
[11:32:35 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): dems are literally just using the same tactics the gop used when Obama got in. party of no and all that....
[11:32:59 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: And I'm finding that the same statistics can be finagled to make a point for anything... like going through the crime/rape statistics in Sweden over the last week. It's been educational.
[11:33:39 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): haven't even started to look into that mess lol
[11:34:00 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): how do u feel about going after recreational pot users in the legal states?
[11:34:14 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): i thought it was all about letting states do what they want
[11:34:22 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: We'll see what happens. I'm hoping that they lean down the government enough to make things work smoother without giving too much power to corporations. They still need oversight and regulations.
[11:34:57 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: I don't like that obviously. There should be nofederal mandates or laws regarding pot, period. It should be a states issue
[11:35:52 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): thank you! its fucked up in light of removing federal transgender protections
[11:36:56 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: With regard to Sweden; It's pretty obvious that crime has gone up, especially sexual crimes like rape in particular. Whether there is a causal relationship between the rise in crime and immigration, particularly Muslim immigration, it's hard to say, but you can't deny the voices on the ground if you actually listen to the Swedish-born citizens living there.
[11:37:13 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): I'm also worried about too many breaks to the corporations
[11:37:36 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): i'll aks one of my best friends in the world
[11:37:41 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): she be swedish
[11:38:18 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): i have crazy relatives who think ALL muslims are radicalized and coming to kill us all
[11:38:22 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: Oh they aren't going to give corps "breaks" like they have in the past. If you fail you fail. They are just loosening the red tape. I'm just hoping they don't loosen it too much.
[11:38:58 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): me too. lots of rich folks with rich friends in the admin right now. makes me nervous.
[11:39:23 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): please tell me you don't believe in the ol'd "trickle down" theory? hehe
[11:39:41 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): more breaks for SMALL business would be keen
[11:39:45 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: Capitalism needs to be given just enough rope to pull themselves up AND enough to hang themselves
[11:39:58 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): it's a tightrope for sure
[11:40:14 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): but if we don't have a planet to do all this stuff, none matters
[11:40:24 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): the pollution stuff worries me too
[11:40:46 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): and how the EPA guy doesn't like the EPA....so yeah. :S
[11:41:45 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: A balance needs to be struck. Right now there is way too much red tape. Just need to find that place where there is enough to protect the people and the planet without unduly hindering progress and the economy.
[11:43:17 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: The problem before was that the government bailed out companies with taxpayer dollars. That was SO bad of a decision... They should have been allowed to fail, that is how true capitalism works.
[11:44:00 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): nooooo shit on that
[11:45:28 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): it's going to be an interesting ride
[11:46:33 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): but the T man needs to maybe just maybe try to seem a tiny bit more actually presidential. maybe it's just me. but he always seems like a hotmess in press conferences. doesn't make me very confident.
[11:47:09 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: I also don't necessarily think that the transgender bathroom thing is necessarily bad. They just bumped it back down to being a states issue rather than a Fed issue. I'm always OK with smaller federal government.
[11:47:31 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: Drumpf is cringeworthy
[11:48:38 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: If he'd dial back the self preening bullshit he'd be a lot better off, but the Left is going to vilify everything he says and does no matter what so I'm not sure what difference it would make
[11:50:47 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: At least if he did though they'd have less actual ammunition to use against him ;)
[11:51:55 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): oh see now, i wholeheartedly believe when it comes to the most basic civil rights - equality issues - we need a federal blanket and then let the states tweak other stuff. plus the trans bathroom phobia is based on myth. the same thing used to be said about black people. then gays. now it's trans.

if he'd be less a maniac it might help soothe some of the concerned independents out there
[11:54:04 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): i mean, I'm indy but will believe he's a disaster no matter what, but it might help his overall approval scores (giggle)
[11:58:58 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): hey Feyd did you hear that Netflix is getting Scorsese's next film?!?!
[11:59:20 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: The government doesn't give us our unalienable human rights, not by God, Gods or dictum. You just have them, they aren't granted by anyone, nor do they need any protection other than what your other unalienable human rights can give you, freedom of speech and freedom to keep and bear arms. That's why I believe in less government. They don't GIVE me my rights, I just HAVE them, and I don't like ANY federal laws dictating those to myself or anyone else.
[12:00:00 PM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: I feel like allowing them to dictate to me what I HAVE they then have the power to take them away, and they DO NOT
[12:00:23 PM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: That is the core of my belief with regard to the Federal government and their role
[12:01:58 PM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): i do completely agree. we are born with them. government doesn't give them. they can only take them away.
but in such a complex society, in a large country, sometimes we need those rights we're born with to have some level of protection. that's all i ask for. like allowing gay people to marry each other. just basic human shit. because people are assholes. this is what i want the fed to help out with really.
[12:02:10 PM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: I think we should repost this discussion in the forums before we get into trouble... :D
[12:02:22 PM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): hey we're admins (sun)
[12:02:30 PM] *** nannabot (NaranjaRa) (skipping) ***
[12:02:47 PM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): but yah we can cnp this mofo
[12:03:03 PM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): because i KNOW you and i agree about a lot of core stuff
[12:03:14 PM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): it's just the execution we debate over lol
[12:03:35 PM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: See they CAN'T take them away as long as we recognize the importance of our Constitution and Amendments, especially the first and second! Life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness! :D
[12:04:07 PM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): also a free press
[12:04:09 PM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: People are going to freaking the fuck out when they start repealing gun laws, holy shit.
[12:04:17 PM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): that's in the 1st ammendment
[12:04:19 PM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: Free press is part of free speech
[12:04:47 PM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): the press therefore is not the enemy of the American people but our final check & balance
[12:06:22 PM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: The media is like any other capitalist endeavor though, the market, aka the People will decide if they trust them and want to participate in their service. I should try and find that CNN clip I saw the other day... :D
[12:08:00 PM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): oh all the big names are owned by the same handful of companies. they'll never report anything that sheds a bad light on the corporations.
[12:08:39 PM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): its the Woodwards & Bernsteins within those places we depend on
[12:10:03 PM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: In case I can't find it; A CNN anchor during a panel discussion was talking (of course) about Drumpf trying to sway public opinion and tell people what to think, to paraphrase she said, "that's our job"... on camera, live... I was like, WOW, lol. :D
[12:10:23 PM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): opinion masquerading as news
[12:10:35 PM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): it's ruining a lot of shit
[12:10:47 PM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): making folks believe anything
[12:11:35 PM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: Well here's the thing, it's ALL colored by personal opinion, but at least some people don't try and hide behind "journalistic integrity" and "impartial news reporting". People that just admit where they are coming from, that I can respect.
[12:12:16 PM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): but the news in general used to be a lot more impartial
[12:12:26 PM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: People just need to realize that they can't trust that, and need to watch everything, research and make up their own minds. I do think a lot of people are doing that now, more and more.
[12:13:28 PM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: Yeah, for sure, but bias has been becoming more and more prevalent over the years. What used to be an editorial is now often portrayed as "news".
[12:13:53 PM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: Found it
[12:15:09 PM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: They cut it close at the end... the facial reactions of the panel were telling after.

[12:15:54 PM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: I think it's because they had to switch to a different video in the news article because CNN took the clip off their official site. ;)
[12:16:46 PM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: Need to make the kid some lunch....
[1:46:35 PM] Phara: Ugh not caught up. Sorry my schedule is all over. Thanks for holding it together. Going to work again after just waking up and coming home at 4 am
[1:54:34 PM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: lol NRA Executive Vice President and CEO Wayne LaPierre was speaking at CPAC, people in chat lost their freaking shit... the repeal NFA petition must have gotten 50k more votes during his 20 minute speech. :D
[1:54:59 PM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: The guy can talk though, and fire up a crowd, but man does the left hate him.
[3:24:09 PM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: Tucker porn is best porn.
----------------------------------------------------------------

For the record, this whole thing about the supposed "white power" hand signs is pure, conspiracy theory nonsense... NON SENSE. Which is why I feel totally comfortable joking about it. It's fucking ridiculous. ;)
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Re: What Happens Next -- A Drumpf Presidency w/ Republican Controlled Congress

Postby Feydakin » Fri Feb 24, 2017 10:52 pm

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Re: What Happens Next -- A Drumpf Presidency w/ Republican Controlled Congress

Postby NaranjaRa » Tue Feb 28, 2017 5:56 am

It Begins: Drumpf’s FCC Launches Attack on Net Neutrality Transparency Rules
"Here's how cost-benefit analysis works in the Drumpf administration and at the Pai FCC: If any favored lobby like the cable industry claims that rules cost them money, the agency will zap those rules—without any regard for their benefits," said Matt Wood, policy director at DC-based public interest group Free Press.

https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/arti ... ency-rules
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Re: What Happens Next -- A Drumpf Presidency w/ Republican Controlled Congress

Postby NaranjaRa » Sun Mar 05, 2017 12:30 am

[2/24/2017 11:05:42 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: Is there anything more fun that trolling Liberal snowflakes? I think not! :D
[2/24/2017 11:06:15 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: I'm in the CPAC livestream just making people lose their minds and it's amazing lol
[2/24/2017 11:17:57 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): the snowflake shit needs to stop...good lord the "buzzwords".... (dull)
[2/24/2017 11:18:12 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): but have fun lol
[2/24/2017 11:18:34 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): libs seriously need to figure out what's important though
[2/24/2017 11:19:07 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): and we need the old school conservatives to take the GOP back from the tea party
[2/24/2017 11:19:32 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): remember the portrayal of conservatism in the Newsroom?
[2/24/2017 11:19:36 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: flashes hand signs
[2/24/2017 11:19:37 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): we need more of that
[2/24/2017 11:20:26 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): oh yeah fuck little Goebbels
[2/24/2017 11:20:44 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): not sure if I believe he's consciously doing that
[2/24/2017 11:20:48 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: The country is making an adjustment after many years of Liberalism.
[2/24/2017 11:20:59 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): as much as all the pics of politcians making the hail satan sign
[2/24/2017 11:21:06 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: lol it's nothing, it' smade up BS fake news.
[2/24/2017 11:21:13 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): oh there's always a lashback
[2/24/2017 11:21:37 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): we go progressive for a bit and then the conservatives undo it all
[2/24/2017 11:21:40 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): tug of war
[2/24/2017 11:21:42 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): stupid


[2/24/2017 11:22:11 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): how u feeling about Drumpf recently Feyd?
[2/24/2017 11:25:06 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): I need to speak to someone who voted for him who isn't completely out of their mind
(chuckle)
[2/24/2017 11:27:20 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: I wish he'd stop being so self congratulatory, but that's his nature.
[2/24/2017 11:27:34 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): i met this girl around the time of the big bad ban, and she was super racist and all about Drumpf. so i started trying to find out where her opinions were. and at one point i told her how people were being asked (as they came into the country) how they felt about Drumpf, if they supported him, etc. and it just boggled my mind that she totally thought that was fine. "because he's our leader" was her answer. creeped me the fuck out.
[2/24/2017 11:28:01 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): dude has that power to make anything about him
[2/24/2017 11:28:12 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): but i guess some folks find that refreshing
[2/24/2017 11:28:50 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: He's done some good and some not so good, but I wish Dems would stop with the obstructionism and at least let his cabinet get approved, and start trying to come up with compromises instead.
[2/24/2017 11:29:41 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: If they couldn't stop Betsy DeVos they aren't going to stop any unless something really, really bad comes out about them...
[2/24/2017 11:30:16 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: Then it can always come about as it did with Flynn, fired/resigned in shame.
[2/24/2017 11:31:39 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: Honestly the more independent research I do, and really drill down to brass tacks on some issues with no political bullshit, I find less and less I dislike. It's really hard to find information that hasn't been tainted by political views though.
[2/24/2017 11:32:01 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): the only person so far that i was actually somewhat ok with was Acosta to replace that POS who owns hardees
the rest are going to destroy their departments from what it sounds like.
i just don't like the idea of everything privitized
[2/24/2017 11:32:35 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): dems are literally just using the same tactics the gop used when Obama got in. party of no and all that....
[2/24/2017 11:32:59 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: And I'm finding that the same statistics can be finagled to make a point for anything... like going through the crime/rape statistics in Sweden over the last week. It's been educational.
[2/24/2017 11:33:39 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): haven't even started to look into that mess lol
[2/24/2017 11:34:00 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): how do u feel about going after recreational pot users in the legal states?
[2/24/2017 11:34:14 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): i thought it was all about letting states do what they want
[2/24/2017 11:34:22 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: We'll see what happens. I'm hoping that they lean down the government enough to make things work smoother without giving too much power to corporations. They still need oversight and regulations.
[2/24/2017 11:34:57 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: I don't like that obviously. There should be nofederal mandates or laws regarding pot, period. It should be a states issue
[2/24/2017 11:35:52 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): thank you! its fucked up in light of removing federal transgender protections
[2/24/2017 11:36:56 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: With regard to Sweden; It's pretty obvious that crime has gone up, especially sexual crimes like rape in particular. Whether there is a causal relationship between the rise in crime and immigration, particularly Muslim immigration, it's hard to say, but you can't deny the voices on the ground if you actually listen to the Swedish-born citizens living there.
[2/24/2017 11:37:13 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): I'm also worried about too many breaks to the corporations
[2/24/2017 11:37:36 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): i'll aks one of my best friends in the world
[2/24/2017 11:37:41 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): she be swedish
[2/24/2017 11:38:18 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): i have crazy relatives who think ALL muslims are radicalized and coming to kill us all
[2/24/2017 11:38:22 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: Oh they aren't going to give corps "breaks" like they have in the past. If you fail you fail. They are just loosening the red tape. I'm just hoping they don't loosen it too much.
[2/24/2017 11:38:58 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): me too. lots of rich folks with rich friends in the admin right now. makes me nervous.
[2/24/2017 11:39:23 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): please tell me you don't believe in the ol'd "trickle down" theory? hehe
[2/24/2017 11:39:41 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): more breaks for SMALL business would be keen
[2/24/2017 11:39:45 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: Capitalism needs to be given just enough rope to pull themselves up AND enough to hang themselves
[2/24/2017 11:39:58 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): it's a tightrope for sure
[2/24/2017 11:40:14 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): but if we don't have a planet to do all this stuff, none matters
[2/24/2017 11:40:24 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): the pollution stuff worries me too
[2/24/2017 11:40:46 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): and how the EPA guy doesn't like the EPA....so yeah. :S
[2/24/2017 11:41:45 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: A balance needs to be struck. Right now there is way too much red tape. Just need to find that place where there is enough to protect the people and the planet without unduly hindering progress and the economy.
[2/24/2017 11:43:17 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: The problem before was that the government bailed out companies with taxpayer dollars. That was SO bad of a decision... They should have been allowed to fail, that is how true capitalism works.
[2/24/2017 11:44:00 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): nooooo shit on that
[2/24/2017 11:45:28 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): it's going to be an interesting ride
[2/24/2017 11:46:33 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): but the T man needs to maybe just maybe try to seem a tiny bit more actually presidential. maybe it's just me. but he always seems like a hotmess in press conferences. doesn't make me very confident.
[2/24/2017 11:47:09 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: I also don't necessarily think that the transgender bathroom thing is necessarily bad. They just bumped it back down to being a states issue rather than a Fed issue. I'm always OK with smaller federal government.
[2/24/2017 11:47:31 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: Drumpf is cringeworthy
[2/24/2017 11:48:38 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: If he'd dial back the self preening bullshit he'd be a lot better off, but the Left is going to vilify everything he says and does no matter what so I'm not sure what difference it would make
[2/24/2017 11:50:47 AM] Paul "Feydakin" Hurtado: At least if he did though they'd have less actual ammunition to use against him ;)
[2/24/2017 11:51:55 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): oh see now, i wholeheartedly believe when it comes to the most basic civil rights - equality issues - we need a federal blanket and then let the states tweak other stuff. plus the trans bathroom phobia is based on myth. the same thing used to be said about black people. then gays. now it's trans.
if he'd be less a maniac it might help soothe some of the concerned independents out there
[2/24/2017 11:54:04 AM] nannabot (NaranjaRa): i mean, I'm indy but will believe he's a disaster no matter what, but it might help his overall approval scores (giggle)
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Re: What Happens Next -- A Drumpf Presidency w/ Republican Controlled Congress

Postby NaranjaRa » Wed May 17, 2017 4:16 pm

LOCK HIM UP! LOCK HIM UP! LOCK HIM UP! LOCK HIM UP! LOCK HIM UP! .......

*cough* jussayin'.

i'm gonna go ahead and call it now, because though it used to be wishful thinking, every week gets more & more unhinged and the GOP is going to eventually either need to sever their support and give up their dreams of having him sign off on all their pet projects or risk having his stain completely pollute their party from now into the foreseeable future:

this twat isn't going to last a single term.
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Re: What Happens Next -- A Drumpf Presidency w/ Republican Controlled Congress

Postby Feydakin » Wed May 17, 2017 4:23 pm

Calls for Article V to be invoked are being balked at by the Democrats. Hmmm, but if you're so sure that you won the popular vote in November, why aren't you sure that if you gave the power back to the people 100% you wouldn't get everything that you've ever dreamed of? At this point I think it's either Article V or armed conflict. Neither of which will end well for the Dems, and they know it. Oh and Seth Rich.
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Re: What Happens Next -- A Drumpf Presidency w/ Republican Controlled Congress

Postby NaranjaRa » Wed May 17, 2017 4:42 pm

Feydakin wrote:Calls for Article V to be invoked are being balked at by the Democrats. Hmmm, but if you're so sure that you won the popular vote in November, why aren't you sure that if you gave the power back to the people 100% you wouldn't get everything that you've ever dreamed of? At this point I think it's either Article V or armed conflict. Neither of which will end well for the Dems, and they know it. Oh and Seth Rich.

not sure i get what you're saying.

i'm talking specifically about the current party in power, the GOP, deciding country is more important than party and reigning in this disastrous, possibly law-skirting president that isn't even really a Republican but instead the direct result of the "Tea Party" movement/reaction to Obama's presidency.

why are you throwing in the Dems and talking armed conflict??? /62
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Re: What Happens Next -- A Drumpf Presidency w/ Republican Controlled Congress

Postby Feydakin » Wed May 17, 2017 10:04 pm

Because that is what it's coming to... people are citing Article V as an alternative to open, all out civil war. Twelve states so far have come on board with the idea, all Red states. There are petitions gaining steam at the local, state level that seems to indicate people want it. It's the ultimate swamp drainer. People need to realize how critical things are becoming. People are pissed off, sick of the political games. They want things to change, they want better lives, not some shitty soap opera to watch every day thanks to the MSM. I have my ear to the tracks, I know what train is coming...
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Re: What Happens Next -- A Drumpf Presidency w/ Republican Controlled Congress

Postby NaranjaRa » Wed May 17, 2017 10:45 pm

ahhh i see. so instead of admitting they fucked up, that Drumpf conned them and the voters, and actually handling their disaster like they're supposed to do as they've been voted into office for - you know, like, running a government & whatnot - and since Drumpf isn't doing all they had hoped for - they're going to just try to instead skirt around the whole damn thing and want make all their dreams come true by amending the Constitution. gotcha.

i'm all for fiscal reins and shorter terms. but much of what's actually happened so far under their "rule" has been oh, let's see, hurting the sick, elderly, and poor, and poisoning farmers...while boosting the military and wealthiest percent of the country. i don't trust ANY single party with total control to make changes to that document, no matter what big-ticket shining good ideas might be leading the charge.

state rights are not the be-all-end-all. there needs to be BALANCE....
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Re: What Happens Next -- A Drumpf Presidency w/ Republican Controlled Congress

Postby Feydakin » Thu May 18, 2017 2:51 am

So the Administration has called for the DoJ to appoint a special counsel to investigate Russian involvement in attempting to influence the election and any possible instances of collusion with the Presidents campaign. Not only that they appointed someone whom I would consider, and any sane person would consider a man that should be beyond reproach in Robert Mueller. Just take a look at this mans credentials. He's 72 years old and has nothing to prove, no horse in this race. Now, I don't think it was necessary, or necessarily wise, because these things tend to end up encompassing much more than their initial purview, and getting out of control and getting out in the weeds. Regardless, the truth will come out, but it's likely to take several months at least, and in the meantime, the Left is going to use this as a talking point and continue to come up with all manner of conspiracy theories because the Administration is under "investigation"... I'm also looking forward to seeing Comey's memos and all of the other material that they requested regarding issues as far back as 2010. I still don't think it's necessary, and I know that the GOP is not going to impeach the President, but I think in getting their wish for a special counsel is going to come back to bite the Dems in the ass in more ways than one. All of these things the DoJ did a half-assed job investigating during Obama's Presidency are going to be looked at again.
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Re: What Happens Next -- A Drumpf Presidency w/ Republican Controlled Congress

Postby NaranjaRa » Mon May 22, 2017 7:07 am

Feydakin wrote:So the Administration has called for the DoJ to appoint a special counsel to investigate Russian involvement in attempting to influence the election and any possible instances of collusion with the Presidents campaign. Not only that they appointed someone whom I would consider, and any sane person would consider a man that should be beyond reproach in Robert Mueller. Just take a look at this mans credentials. He's 72 years old and has nothing to prove, no horse in this race.

agreed 100%. there are a *few* things about Mueller i'm not thrilled about, but for the most part i think he's as close to a middle-ground choice as we're going to get. i just wish the whole counsel could be composed entirely of Independents with NO party allegiance whatsoever.

Feydakin wrote:Regardless, the truth will come out, but it's likely to take several months at least, and in the meantime, the Left is going to use this as a talking point and continue to come up with all manner of conspiracy theories because the Administration is under "investigation"...

as if the Right would not do the same thing if the situation was not reversed...as if they did not when Bill Clinton was in the hot seat?

not to mention, the main issue is no longer "conspiracy theory". this IS important. i mean FFS it's literally ONLY 4 MONTHS into Drumpf's presidency and there's already impeachment talk, and even by members of his own party. the word unprecedented comes into play once again. the idea that a foreign, hostile power like Russia might have meddled in our elections is so mind-blowingly frightening, coupled with the fact they're messing with other nations' elections as well, makes me believe we are literally in a new kind of war right now.

and the fact that his supporters are still trying to downplay it ceases to make me angry and now just makes me laugh at such foolishness and hypocrisy. because i know for a fact that again, if this was a Democratic president, the Right - the party of Ronald Reagan(!!!!) - would absolutely be LOSING THEIR FUCKING MINDS. but mention Russia and the first thing you get from a lot of Drumpf supporters is:

Image

/rotfl i guess they'll keep wearing their damn party blinders as long as possible...

Feydakin wrote:I'm also looking forward to seeing Comey's memos and all of the other material that they requested regarding issues as far back as 2010. I still don't think it's necessary, and I know that the GOP is not going to impeach the President...

so much has happened from Wednesday when you posted this through the end of the week, that i don't know....maybe President Pence is starting to look better and better to some folks in the party. we shall definitely see...tis going to be a long, wild haul no doubt.
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Re: What Happens Next -- A Drumpf Presidency w/ Republican Controlled Congress

Postby Skywalker » Wed Jul 19, 2017 5:19 pm

Currently watching Drumpf on Fox Business

All he stating is that Democrats of obstructionist, that they offer nothing but Single Payer. That Single Payer will bankrupt the United States.

He wants the Federal Government to focus on the Middle East, North Korea, and not on healthcare that is up to the States.

We will have forms of insurance you do not even know about. Repeal bordism taxes, the bill also provides for expanded coverage options, stabilize insurance markets, currently, the markets are gone. We will protect pre-existing coverage, according to the Democrats, people are dying. --- Trumps words not mine.


I will see if I can not find this later. This apparently happened at the White House.

So on wants the White House and the Federal Government only needs to work on the Middle East and North Korea. That everything else can be done by the states, what the fuck?
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Re: What Happens Next -- A Drumpf Presidency w/ Republican Controlled Congress

Postby NaranjaRa » Wed Jul 19, 2017 8:17 pm

i can't even follow the healthcare mess anymore. way too close to home & life important to the point the stress just immobilizes me. if Medicaid goes away for all intents & purposes my life will be mostly done. /62

and i don't believe it's dead...not yet. that's what they kept saying about the ACA. so until the proverbial fat lady sings...nope, not buying it yet.
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Re: What Happens Next -- A Drumpf Presidency w/ Republican Controlled Congress

Postby Skywalker » Wed Jul 19, 2017 9:48 pm

I only follow it because my mom has Medicare. So I am trying to make sure that she keeps her care. Without it, there is no way we can afford the 3000+ a month that is paid by her drug coverage.


Personally I have almost given up trying to follow any coverage. It was nice for two days when I was just watching Hulu with no damn news.
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Re: What Happens Next -- A Drumpf Presidency w/ Republican Controlled Congress

Postby NaranjaRa » Wed Jul 19, 2017 10:10 pm

that's about how much my medications would cost a month. but then, without Medicaid i wouldn't be able to even afford the monthly doctor visits to get the prescriptions in the first place, so there's that.

honestly, i'll shoot myself in the head before i have to live with the pain i have and not be able to get any kind of relief. so whether they kill Medicaid/Medicare (because i'm in the middle of my disability case just awaiting my court date) or take away protection for pre-existing conditions, i refuse to suffer like that. period. they can throw my body on the White House steps, mutherfuckers.
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Re: What Happens Next -- A Drumpf Presidency w/ Republican Controlled Congress

Postby Skywalker » Wed Jul 19, 2017 10:24 pm

Nope, I feel ya and understand. It is hard to live, most folks don't know is that Medicare only covers 80 percent, the other 20 must be paid. That is on top of the monthly fee of 180 a month. If it was not for the extra help that she gets from Medicaid then she would have to pay each time she goes to the doctor. The state pays the part that she can not afford, hell that I can not afford to pay.

I am writing who can I write to ensure that Medicaid is protected as well as Medicare.

While I may never get health care coverage does not mean that I want to take it away from other people. That is just being an asshole to other humans, I am not on that train, ever.

I just find it hard to believe that the head of the Republican Party stated that he and his party will now own their mistake of having a shitty healthcare bill. That is is the fault of the Democrats. Were the Dems meant to state that this is a wonderful replacement to the ACA and fully support it? Hell, a good number of Republicans will not support it.
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Re: What Happens Next -- A Drumpf Presidency w/ Republican Controlled Congress

Postby NaranjaRa » Thu Jul 20, 2017 2:34 am

they are all pathetic piece of shit criminals for what they are doing. they've had 8 years to come up with a plan and they have nothing but a pile of horsecrap that serves as reparations for the rich and as the CBO just came out with a new estimate, will cut coverage from 32 million others.

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