when people of muslim heritage challenge fundamentalism | Ka

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Corgimom
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Postby Corgimom » Tue Mar 22, 2016 10:37 pm

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Phara
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Postby Phara » Fri Apr 01, 2016 2:18 am

HMM, interested to see how this goes. definitely a relevant topic these days.
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MAK
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Postby MAK » Fri Apr 01, 2016 9:57 pm

While I support the general message in this TedTalk, I also have to say that it doesn't really do justice by the struggle of the islamic world against extremism. Everything she spoke about was beautiful, except for her relentless use of the phrase "islamists terrorism". She is, unwillingly ascribing to islam a phenomenon that Islam itself has outlawed. Look, I know it isn't easy for people standing on the outside to see this, but you have no idea how much it hurts to hear the name of your religion concatinated to the word "terrorism". And anyone who knows enough history would see how ironic this is.

Here's a very brief break-down for those who care:

Modern extremist ideology, spread through the Wahabi thought (as she mentions) is rooted in early Kharijite thought. The "Khawarij"(Translated: Outlaws/Those on the outside) were a group of fanatics who broke OUT of the islamic mainstream with their crazy ideology, thus they where aptly dubbed "Those on the outside". It is Ironic, that their modern day followers are called "islamists" when islam dubbed them outlaws to begin with.

Furthermore, these extremists are today commonly referred to by a lot of Arabs as "Takfiryin"(Pseudo-Translated: Infidel-iators, i.e Those who dub any adversary "infidel"), as opposed to being called "islamists".

The Prophet of Islam, Muhammad, prophesizes about the "outlaws/khawarij" in the following speech:
The Prophet Muhammad wrote:"A group of people will part with my nation. They read the Holy Qur'an. Your reading compared to their reading is nothing and so is your prayer and your fast compared to their prayer and fast (i.e they are over zealous). They read the Holy Qur'an and think that it is with them but it is against them. Their prayers do not go beyond their throats (i.e they do not use their intellect). They depart from Islam as an arrow departs from a bow."


and if you are reaaaalllyy interested, read more about these people here:
http://www.al-islam.org/brother-prophet-muhammad-imam-ali-mohamad-jawad-chirri/26-al-khawarij-seceders

http://www.al-islam.org/wahhabia-movement-true-image/wahhabi-and-khawarij#f_1b79c800_6


All that being said, Karima's approach is very easy for people to relate to. They don't need to be given a history lesson to understand what she's saying. Therefore, I would not deem her approach to be without merit. I just wish she wouldn't use the "islamist" phrase.
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ink
God's Fountain Pen
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Postby ink » Fri Apr 01, 2016 11:45 pm

MAK wrote:While I support the general message in this TedTalk, I also have to say that it doesn't really do justice by the struggle of the islamic world against extremism. Everything she spoke about was beautiful, except for her relentless use of the phrase "islamists terrorism". She is, unwillingly ascribing to islam a phenomenon that Islam itself has outlawed. Look, I know it isn't easy for people standing on the outside to see this, but you have no idea how much it hurts to hear the name of your religion concatinated to the word "terrorism". And anyone who knows enough history would see how ironic this is.

Here's a very brief break-down for those who care:

Modern extremist ideology, spread through the Wahabi thought (as she mentions) is rooted in early Kharijite thought. The "Khawarij"(Translated: Outlaws/Those on the outside) were a group of fanatics who broke OUT of the islamic mainstream with their crazy ideology, thus they where aptly dubbed "Those on the outside". It is Ironic, that their modern day followers are called "islamists" when islam dubbed them outlaws to begin with.

Furthermore, these extremists are today commonly referred to by a lot of Arabs as "Takfiryin"(Pseudo-Translated: Infidel-iators, i.e Those who dub any adversary "infidel"), as opposed to being called "islamists".

The Prophet of Islam, Muhammad, prophesizes about the "outlaws/khawarij" in the following speech:
The Prophet Muhammad wrote:"A group of people will part with my nation. They read the Holy Qur'an. Your reading compared to their reading is nothing and so is your prayer and your fast compared to their prayer and fast (i.e they are over zealous). They read the Holy Qur'an and think that it is with them but it is against them. Their prayers do not go beyond their throats (i.e they do not use their intellect). They depart from Islam as an arrow departs from a bow."


and if you are reaaaalllyy interested, read more about these people here:
http://www.al-islam.org/brother-prophet-muhammad-imam-ali-mohamad-jawad-chirri/26-al-khawarij-seceders

http://www.al-islam.org/wahhabia-movement-true-image/wahhabi-and-khawarij#f_1b79c800_6


All that being said, Karima's approach is very easy for people to relate to. They don't need to be given a history lesson to understand what she's saying. Therefore, I would not deem her approach to be without merit. I just wish she wouldn't use the "islamist" phrase.


this is actually very important, although our beliefs might differ a bit, the importance of not drinking from a cup of ignorance is huge. i think that the over-zealous within the confines of any belief, corrupts and leads to hypocrisy
it is not good to have zeal without knowledge, nor to be hasty and miss the way. prov 19:2 ;)


..so respect for that Mak, ty bro
we are, what we allow to occupy us..





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MAK
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Postby MAK » Sun Apr 03, 2016 10:52 pm

ink wrote:
this is actually very important, although our beliefs might differ a bit, the importance of not drinking from a cup of ignorance is huge. i think that the over-zealous within the confines of any belief, corrupts and leads to hypocrisy
it is not good to have zeal without knowledge, nor to be hasty and miss the way. prov 19:2 ;)


..so respect for that Mak, ty bro



Word! I love that passage by the way!
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Corgimom
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Postby Corgimom » Wed May 04, 2016 2:42 pm

Now if we could just get the 'naming can be pain' message to the right.
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